Talk:Eggnog

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Wikibooks

Shouldn't the recipe be moved to Wikibooks: Cookbook? [[User:JonMoore|Jon, Conqueror of Men | (Talk!)]] 04:57, 29 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I believe it is already included (or some recipie for it, if not this one). Since I just adopted this article into the WikiProject Cocktails (despite the fact is is not really a cocktail, but is repeatedly added to our List of cocktails), transwiki merges and cleanups are part of our project's goals. We will look into this in more detail, though probably not right away. --Willscrlt 12:12, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Warm Eggnog

Eggnog can be cold?????????? what, that is a disgusting idea. ewwww. Egg nog HAS to be somewhere between hot and warm (yes, a little bit of internet research shows that eggnog is almost always served cold, but jeez; id never heard of the idea before today.) The bellman 07:29, 2005 Apr 18 (UTC)

The thought of drinking warm Egg Nog makes me sick. --Graphic 05:43, 8 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Ditto Giant89 20:02, 24 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You're incredibly wrong. In my 22 years on this earth I have never seen warm eggnog nor heard of anyone drinking it. Are you from Mars?

I've never heard of cold eggnog until reading this. Sounds vomit-worthy. Cold eggy milk.....lovely. Both ways must be common in some places I guess. Patch86 17:10, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I wonder if some comment should be made regarding the fact that, now that many coffee chains (Starbucks, et al) are making eggnogg lattes with real eggnog, warm or hot steamed eggnog is being consumed more often, even if it is combined with a small amount of espresso? (Personally, I find both warm and cold eggnog tasty)

Good eggnog is good warm or cold (at least to me). Many of the flavors are stronger when heated, and the entire drink tastes creamier when chilled. In our family, it was usually served chilled in a pitcher or punch bowl, but was allowed to warm to room temperature (maybe not the healthiest thing, but we never got sick). Of course, the added alcohol in the "leaded" variety (the one in the bowl) probably helped kill off stuff, and the pitcher (which had no alcohol) was smaller and refilled more frequently. Bad eggnog (and there are many brands that fall into that category) tastes bad cold, hot, or anywhere in between. If you don't like the way the nog tastes, change brands, not temperatures. --Willscrlt 12:08, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've never had hot eggnog, nor heard of it till now, and further I LOVE cold eggnog, and hot eggnog sounds distinctly odd.... 21:58, 8 April 2007 (UTC)~

Whaddya mean, "Since the 1960s, eggnog has often been served cold and without alcohol, both of which are significant departures from its historical origins."? I often had cold, non-alcoholic eggnog during my childhood in the 1950s. I suspect it was served long before then. Kostaki mou 21:57, 31 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I believe I have older source material (bar manuals, etc) that may provide a link between what we think of as modern day eggnog and earlier drinks, particularly from the American colonial period and Victorian/Edwardian England. People consumed alcohol more as a matter of course in daily nutrition, and of course spirits had antibacterial properties on the raw unpasteurized milk and eggs of the day. I'll put this in my to-do's. Consuelo D'Guiche 20:50, 11 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

To be honest, never liked the stuff, so don't even recall whether it was served hot or cold (in my 50 years on the planet, so perhaps a little more experience than our 22 year old expert above). But, I do recall it being served out of a punch bowl usually, so probably cold (don't know how you'd keep contents of a punchbowl warm - but a little ice will keep the contents cool). I also remember it fresh out of the refrigerator from a pitcher or, apparently heaven forbid, a store-bought carton (not exactly sure why this is such a turnoff). I can't imagine it a room temperature (that would be nasty) and, if too warm, you'd probably end up with a cup o' custard. Cold would also be better from a bacteria standpoint as well, especially for a long holiday party.Jmdeur (talk) 04:02, 16 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Eggnog POV

This is almost more along the lines of funny than serious business, but isn't the sentence "Although rarely as good as 'homemade' recipes (in which the egg is in strands somewhat resembling mucous), ready-made eggnog..." kind of blatant POV? I'm laughing just typing this.Tommstein 10:22, 26 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It's better than what's in the article now. Non POV version reads "Although eggnog can be produced from "homemade" recipes (in which the egg is in strands resembling mucous)" almost sounds like the strands are intentional. -- JP Godfrey 16:18, 9 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Are you serious? Have you actually tried any good homemade receipes? Mine is never "mucousy" and kicks the crap out of anything you might buy in a store. Considering the preservatives and other crap they put in to keep it on the shelf for 8 weeks, is this really a surprise to you? You've never had a homemade cake, or icecream, or mashed potatoes? Very sad. --E090 16:01, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The entire article reads as very USA orientated, including the references, yet the drink originated in Europe, probably England. And it was always made with alcohol. 31.125.36.25 (talk) 02:12, 13 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

What's the deal with seasonals?

I love eggnog. Why is it not available all year around? The economist in me says that there's a complementary element (it works well with the atmosphere of the season) and a crowding element (it's most fun only once in a while and onlt good while drinking it with others, like at parties). However, both do not seem strong enough to counter the benefits of being able to drink it all year around (people, for example, tend to spread their consumption in the form of Diminishing returns). So what's the deal? --Atlastawake 04:24, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I wonder that exact same thing, and the reason I originally came to this article was to see if it said why. You'd think that at least one company would be bold and start selling year-round, since there's not an eggnog monopoly. I'd drink it every day if I could, especially my favorite brand. Maybe this is an economic opportunity for someone looking to get rich.Tommstein 05:15, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Someone just added a statement to the article saying that in the United States the federal government mandates when eggnog can be made and the recipe that must be used. This sounds like bullcrap to me. Can evidence of this be produced?Tommstein 03:25, 12 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds like Vandalism to me, but I couldn't say for sure. JP Godfrey 12:12, 12 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Eggnog is usually sold in the dairy case at the supermarket during the Christmas season. Since milk is a big mover throughout the year, most stores don't want to waste valuable shelf space the other 11 months out of the year on the few people who want a glass of nog in July. Most of the big chain stores (Kroger, Meijer, Winn Dixie) sell eggnog year round, it's just in a can - far away from the milk (go look for it, it's there, ask a clerk for help). During the Christmas season there's enough demand to stock some in the dairy case.--Legomancer 06:19, 19 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The availability of eggnog year-round might very well be regional. I've never heard of any of those chains which you refer to as "big" (although Winn Dixie sounds familiar, but not in a super-market context), and I've definitely never seen eggnog in a can. Only traditional dairy cardboard(?) cartons and plastic jugs similar to lemonades or iced teas. JesseRafe 05:59, 29 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The brand in a can is (or at least was several years ago when I last looked) is Borden. www.bordeneggnog.com Borden Eggnog is even available for purchase online. In my opinion (and I know of at least two people who disagree with me), the canned stuff is no match for a good quality dairy-case eggnog. Then again, some dairy ones taste so funky, almost anything else would taste better. I have never been brave enough to try homemade for the potential health risks (see the question below). And, yes, Kroger, Meijer, and Winn-Dixie are major supermarkets in the United States, though not on the West Coast where I live. --Willscrlt 12:01, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Salmonella

Should this article mention the risk of salmonella inherent in eating raw eggs? Also, does anyone know how much alcohol it would take to kill any salmonella that might be in the eggs? —BenFrantzDale 13:57, 22 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I dunno. There's as many cooked eggnog recipes as there are raw. I suppose if you're really concerned about it you can either a) cook the nog b) use pasteurized eggs c) use egg substitutes. Without testing, I would assume no amount of rum, brandy, or cognac would kill salmonella. Grain alcohol used as a disinfectant/antibacterial agent is most effective at a strength of 70% by volume. Stronger or weaker tends to lessen the antiseptic qualities of it. Since almost no liquor is that strong out of the bottle, let alone diluted, there's little chance it would kill off any bacteria. Maybe if you used Everclear 95% and mixed it 3 to 1 with the Eggnog it would kill Salmonella, but it would probably be undrinkable. Cheers,--Legomancer 14:53, 22 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah it's a worry but pasteurized eggs are not an option. They don't whip up. I buy very fresh eggs from a standard supermarket. I've gotten bad cream but never a bad egg in over 75 batches. --E090 16:03, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would think you could blend the eggs w/ a high percentage alcohol (Everclear) to kill salmonella, then cut w/ water, flavored alcohol (Whiskey/Brandy/etc.) and blend into the milk. That would be a better use of alcohol and yield a drinkable blend. --MP9 0430GMT 22 Dec 06

It would be nice to get some statistics about bad-Egg Nog food poisoning...

So what about the stuff you buy at the liquor and grocery store? Any chance of getting salmonella in comercially produced versions of the stuff?--E tac (talk) 18:00, 29 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I was just wondering if you could actually freeze Egg-Nog in cartons? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.217.208.120 (talk) 15:47, 9 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This might help shed some light on this: http://www.extension.umn.edu/info-u/nutrition/BJ639.html -- as well as providing a reference to update information in the main article. As for getting it from commercial products, they probably use pasteurized eggs, otherwise if someone got it they'd get sued. And, as for the seemingly off topic feezing eggnog question, yes, you can freeze it, I've done it, nice having eggnog in July, :) Ancyker (talk) 12:18, 12 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Is this an American thing?

Is this mainly an American thing? I don't think I ever saw this stuff for sale the 25 years I lived in England, but since moving to the US I see it every Christmas. If it is, shouldn't the article mention it? 66.92.237.111 01:16, 23 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I've never seen "ready made" eggnog here in Britain, but I've seen it homemade (and made it myself) many many times. I think its not as big here as in the US, but the best stuff is always homemade anyway! Patch86 17:13, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've lived in England for 21 years and not once seen it on sale here - only in TV shows from America. I'll add something. JiMternet 11:29, 24 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe it's just not an English thing.Tommstein 19:21, 24 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

What?! Eggnog is specifically an English thing. Here's a brief history http://whatscookingamerica.net/Eggnog.htm. It's commonly called posset or egg flip and evolved among England's upper class - mainly because the locals didn't have access to milk & eggs (or refrigeration). Eggnog became much more popular in the United States because of the access to milk & eggs farmed locally, and rum via the Triangular Trade with the Caribbean. Cheers,--Legomancer 09:32, 25 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I first remember seeing it in England as a ready made drink about 60 years ago, it was a traditional Christmas drink in the UK for many years before that. 31.125.36.25 (talk) 02:16, 13 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It may have roots in England but I've not heard of it over here. JiMternet 20:13, 25 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Eggnogg is an American heavy rock band. They also enjoy drinking Eggnogg.

I'm from the UK and have never met anybody who didn't know what egg-nog was. Perhaps it is a regional thing? --Shastrix 16:40, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

How odd. A buddy of mine is British and he was talking about the evolution of tea. In general, tea is served hot, with the exception of a lot of the countries colonized by or heavily traded with England. The Indies, Malaysia, and the United States for example, generally serve iced tea more than hot. I don't have a cite for that, so take it for what it's worth. If true, it's a good example of us yanks taking your customs and twisting them to our savage uses. :) --Legomancer 03:28, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Well, egg-nog sounds about as disgusting as tea to me, so perhaps I have just tuned it out.. but stil... ugh. JiMternet 16:42, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'm British, and I had to be told what eggnog was, aged well into my twenties. It's almost unknown in the UK from my experience, and not *remotely* a well-known Christmas beverage. Incidentally, how about a source for the "Since the 1960s, eggnog has been served cold and without alcohol" bit? Why then, and who decided to change it? 86.132.142.201 04:35, 1 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No source but I can certainly attest that when I was growing up in the U.S. (and I was born in 1968) we always had cold eggnog around Christmas and New Years, and it was always available without alcohol. The grownups could put a dash of booze in if they liked, but the "default setting" for eggnog purchased at the supermarket was alcohol-free. I suspect selling ready-made eggnog at the supermarket had a lot to do with changing the customs (no source for this either, so I won't put it in, but on a talk page I can speculate to my heart's content). Laws on selling alcohol in supermarkets vary from county to county in the U.S., but in general, supermarkets can't sell any liquor other than beer and wine. So if they want to sell eggnog, it has to be alcohol-free. And (unless it's canned, as someone mentioned above) since it's made with milk and eggs, it has to be kept cold in the supermarket or it will spoil. So what was available to shoppers? Cold, alcohol-free eggnog. Now, some people probably took it home, warmed it up, and added booze, but other people just drank it as it came, and liked it that way. —An gr 20:21, 19 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

bAHAH 20 year olds saying in all my years... hahah ..well if perhaps everyone on wikipedia wasnt 20 years old someone might have heard of these things.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.31.122.158 (talk) 00:28, 14 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Central Europe? That is Germany and Böhmen. I have lived in various parts of Europe all my life. I have never come across this drink, I had to go here to see what they actually are talking about in american TV-shows. This drink does not exist outside the US. In europe we drink Glühwein for christmas. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.216.160.191 (talk) 07:35, 17 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. I am central European (Austrian), and I've just had this drink for the first time in my life here in the US. I came to this site trying to find out what it is. What we do have is advocaat, but I'm not sure it should be considered the "cognac version" of Eggnog. Furthermore, it is not linked to Christmas at all. I therefore removed the sentence. Martg76 (talk) 17:52, 19 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. I've not come across Egg Nog once in the UK. The intro should be rewritten to say that this is a drink popular in the US. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.74.234.212 (talk) 19:05, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wow. That was quick. Good work! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.77.164.167 (talk) 16:07, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, it's not just an US thing. I've seen Eggnog being sold right next to Glühwein all over southern Germany. Farkeld (talk) 20:11, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pennsylvania Dutch

209.244.30.103 added: "Pennsylvania Dutch is a leading producer of eggnog, with a 30 proof bottle." Without providing any source for this statement, it rather sounds like commercial spam from an eggnog producing company that would like to spread it's name brand a bit wider. If that is not the case, please expand on this by (1) providing verifiable information showing that Pensylvania Ducth is a leading producer, and (2) offering a bit more information as to why anyone should care about it. I am personally aware of the Pennsylvania Dutch brand, as it is sold at Costco around Christmas, which makes it familiar (to me at least), but not necessarily notable. --Willscrlt 08:28, 13 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This IP has provided other random vandalism in the past month. Craigbutz 18:30, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Cleanup Kudos

Great job on cleaning up the article, Blaxthos. It reads so much better now. Thank you. :-) --Willscrlt 06:02, 14 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Be careful of copyright infringement

I just cleaned up some information that was added to the history section. The source was an article by Nanna Rognvaldardottir that appears to be the primary reference on many sites attempting to provide history on eggnog. All three references I used to rewrite the history section make use of Ms. Rognvaldardottir's research. I was unable to find the original source of the article, though the What's Cooking America site may have a complete copy of it. There is more information to be gleaned from all three sources (especially The Kitchen Project's site), though that cite does not cite its sources, which makes it a weak resource from wich to quote. More should be said about the Colonial American history of eggnog and probably also about the more modern history (post-Industrial era) of it. --Willscrlt 19:12, 16 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Puke

Doesnt eggnog like make people vomit easilly if drunk really fast? Didnt they do that on Jackass ?

Er, I'd imagine drinking any uncooked egg / milk mixture very fast would make you feel a bit dicky. Not really encyclopedia material, though. Patch86 17:16, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oral fixation

"This drink is also popular because of its strong similarity to breast milk." Vandalism? I couldn't find a thing to support this statement after a rather extensive Google search...rather amusing, but utter nonsense--unless you remember what breast milk tasted like. Indeed, breast milk chilled over ice with a little nutmeg and cinnamon, anyone? Thought not. Cloud 9 09:07, 1 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

well, actually... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.51.66.32 (talk) 01:29, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Carton

I've never see someone drink egg nog out of a carton. Not that I think it isn't done, but I would say it was not to be considered common by this article —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.69.145.180 (talk) 01:31, 15 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I will admit that I have drunk eggnog out of the carton. In my defense, my husband is the only other one who drinks it, so I didn't think it was TOO horrible a crime. It does taste better from a punch cup though, with a dash of Frangelico and a sprinkle of nutmeg. —Preceding unsigned comment added by MaeDaisy (talk • contribs) 14:36, 24 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Middle Ages origins

The origin goes back at least as far back as 13th century Europe, as "lait de poule" ("chicken's milk"), a generic type of medicinal beverage using raw egg, sugar, and hot water or milk. In 1270, the very devout Louis IX of France refused the eggnogg prepared by his doctors because it was a time of fasting:

Peu de temps avant sa mort, un samedi, il refusa de prendre un « lait de poule », recommandé par les médecins, parce que son confesseur n’était pas là pour lui en octroyer la licence.

Before his death, on a Saturday, he refused to drink a "chicken's milk", recommended by the doctors, because his confessor wasn't there to grant him this licence.

-- Charles-Victor Langlois, Saint-Louis, Philippe le Bel, les derniers Capétiens directs, 1911, book 1, chapter 2, online.

In 1314, Philip IV of France too reputedly died refusing an eggnogg on a fasting day.[1]

62.147.39.138 (talk) 14:55, 10 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

One v. two words

I'm removing the unsourced assertion (sometimes confused as "egg nog") from the lead sentence - judging by the photo accompanying this article[2], it is common for producers to use two words instead of one. SixFourThree (talk) 20:29, 21 November 2008 (UTC)SixFourThree[reply]

Why did it lose popularity in Britain?

As discussed above, eggnog is not very well known in Britain these days, and very few people have it as part of their Christmas celebrations. Yet the "History" section suggests an English origin for the drink. What happened? 81.159.62.0 (talk) 04:03, 24 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The section goes on to state that while eggs and milk were luxuries in England, they were plentiful and cheap in the Colonies, where the vast majority of the population lived on their own farms. Also, rum was inexpensive in America because of the Triangular Trade with the Caribbean. It wasn't so much that it "lost" popularity in Britain, it really wasn't ever all that popular, as only the aristocracy could afford it. AlexiusHoratius 04:54, 24 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have known what eggnog was since the 1950s, however we would normally have commercially made advocaat at Christmas. I have the impression that the non-alcoholic version is a US thing - similar to cider which can be non-alcoholic in the us — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.226.49.230 (talk) 11:13, 15 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

"Eggnog has long been believed to be an excellent source of magnesium."

I want to know more about this, particularly because Eggnog isn't naturally occurring >_> -74.4.253.207 (talk) 22:27, 30 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I concur the phrase "has long been believed" is not only passive and disorderly but is also vague about its current status and its exact past status. 65.10.5.145 (talk) 10:53, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No mention of Commercial Eggnog? Most people probably have only had commercially produced eggnog.

Its important to note that commercially produced eggnog differs significantly from what is in this article. It does not normally contain eggs (I've never seen it with eggs), and invariably lists "Modified Milk Ingredients" as the first ingredient over milk, if it contains milk at all. I picked up a list online but its actually difficult to find them because its probably not good for marketing: "Sugar, Glucose Solids, Cocoa, Modified Milk Ingredients, Hydrogenated Canola Oil, Partially Hydrogenated Coconut Oil, Sodium Caseinate, Salt, Tricalcium Phosphate, Modified Cellulose Gel, Dipotassium Phosphate, Mono and Diglycerides, Silicon Dioxide, Artificial Flavor, Natural Color, Maltol " - Note the absence of milk, vanilla, cinnamon, eggs, or nutmeg.

I think its important to point out that commercially produced and available eggnog does not even remotely resemble traditional home made eggnog, and also possibly why this is (we all know why but in encyclopedic language), and try to list companies that still produce and sell traditional eggnog (if any exist) Mrrealtime (talk) 02:00, 20 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Health concerns

Why don't they mention (beyond the fda) about the health concerns of drinking uncooked egg. Can't you get salmonella from that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.31.254 (talk) 18:33, 25 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

While a higher alcohol percentage is needed to sterilize surfaces (such as 70%), in a liquid, a much lower percentage is required (can be as low as 5%, depending on other factors). Many alcoholic eggnogs contain much higher levels, and very high sugar contents can also sterilize it. Egg-containing store bought varieties are usually pasteurized and/or made with pasteurized eggs. While you can (and many people do) get salmonella from eggs, the rate isn't actually horribly high. For example, I've had raw eggs throughout my life in various forms (most frequently with alcohol-free eggnog — I make it year round) and have not yet had a bout of salmonella. There's more to this, but, not really the place to discuss it. In summary, there isn't extended mention of it in the article because the incidence is fairly low, especially in comparison to more common foods. — al-Shimoni (talk) 22:04, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Also Salmonella is on the egg shell, not on its inside. Throw your raw eggs in boiling water for 10 seconds, then the bacteria is dead. The inside of a fresh egg, thats has NO CRACKS, is sterile. --95.88.233.19 (talk) 11:45, 17 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Besides that, i have eaten raw cookie dough and cake dough since childhood, wich also contains raw eggs. Never had a problem with that. A healthy person can even eat something with salmonella without getting sick from it. ---95.88.233.19 (talk) 11:45, 17 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Etymology: Egg Knock?

Perhaps the drink was named so b/c it knocked you out pretty quick (the alcoholic version)! ;)

I'm from Europe, and what we call Egg Liquor (which is also traditionally drunk on X-Mas) makes you drunk really fast.

91.51.207.57 (talk) 23:38, 2 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Picture Caption

"A carton and a glass of eggnog from Montreal, called by its French name lait de poule, which literally means "breast milk."" Uhh...no it doesn't. "Poule" is French for "hen". 68.149.0.212 (talk) 07:31, 5 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"lait de poule" translates to milk of hen or chicken. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.181.171.118 (talk) 08:55, 30 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Initial description

The initial description of the drink says "liquor" amongst the ingredients, then says rum, whisky or brandy can be added. Aren't these liquor, as well? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.155.41.163 (talk) 16:26, 20 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Avalibility

It should be noted in the article that eggnog is only available in stores around Christmas. In Canada, eggnog first appears on shelves around Thanksgiving.--Auric talk 01:03, 9 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

eggnog

Where is the recipe? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.232.49.247 (talk) 20:28, 4 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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It is mentioned in Daddy Home 2 movie.

There is a scene in Daddy Home 2, Brad kids wants to drink eggnog but Sara stops them. Please mention this in fiction section. Ram nareshji (talk) 03:24, 13 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]